Transcript
of the Youtube documentary
Intro
- Greetings
8/22 edit - to clarify, there is a hell, of suffering that exists for those worthy of it, but it's not forever.
Hello, I'm
your host Bill Weather.
Up
front I tell you, I'm going to so disprove this doctrine of eternal
torment, that anyone who has any inkling of honesty in them, has to
at least come away from this video saying that I did make some very
strong points in favor of this view, and that is, that the Holy
Scriptures teach that the lost without Christ, will be annihilated
and not eternally alive in a place of everlasting suffering called
hell, which from here on in, I will refer to as the doctrine of
eternal torment or the doctrine of eternal life in hell. If after
death, one feels suffering in hell, as some Christians propose, then
it is not at all death, but eternal life in hell, since a lost soul
they say, can feel pain and torture in that place.
Furthermore,
we should not take a view of the cults on this doctrine. This is not
an issue of salvation. What we believe about hell does not get us to
heaven. The bible says if we truly believe Jesus Christ is Lord, then
we shall be saved.
But
this one doctrine of eternal life in hell, has turned away many
people from Christ, because of its inherent nature of being so
unbelievable and so illogical and so not of sound and fair judgment,
that it has very much, contributed to the unbelief of the atheists
and agnostics.... and who can blame them. That a loving God would
even create such a place of everlasting suffering and cruel torture.
I
will also cover the supernatural experiences of people who have
visited hell. I ask the listener, to not be presumptuous and
spiritually trigger happy. Everything, will be explained.
PART
1 - 12 reasons why not to believe it
Reason
#1
Scripture
does not support the doctrine of eternal torment. I will cover this
in greater detail in part 2 of this video series, but let me just
give you a thought to look forward to on this. Luke chapter 16, the
parable of the rich man in hell, is probably the strongest support
for the doctrine of eternal torment, but the problem with this view,
is that there is no time frame given anywhere in Luke 16 on
the rich man in hell, so while we may believe there is a hell to
shun, it is presumptuous for Christians to assume it's length of time
is everlasting upon the wicked. Again, I will go into greater detail
on this in part 2.
#2
For the doctrine of eternal torment to be real, you would have to
redefine the biblical words “death”, “second death” ,
“destruction” and “perish” to mean eternal life in hell. Now
logically, can we say that the word death means eternal life in hell?
How about the word perish? Can the word perish mean eternal life in
hell? If so, then we would have to re-define those 4 words, death,
2nd death, destruction and perish to mean something far
different than what we know those words to be. We would have to
redefine all of them to mean eternal life.... whether that be eternal
life in heaven or eternal life in hell.
That
makes no sense. The very word perish and destruction, the nature of
these words align with annihilation, meaning no more thoughts or
feelings, death, not eternal life in hell. Can we logically say the
word perish and destruction means eternal life????...... in hell????
This is an intellectual dishonesty among fundamentalists and they are
turning many people away from Christ thru this doctrine.
We
also have to consider the solidity of the definition of words. I
mean, if a word like perish can be so changed, to mean something far
different than what we know that self evident word to mean, then no
word in the bible is safe from being stretched to mean something far
different. So then, God couldn't even clearly communicate to us,
since every self evident word in the bible would be open to stretched
to mean something far different than what we know self evident words
to be. If death doesn't mean death and perish doesn't mean perish, then
grace doesn't mean grace and faith doesn't mean faith, do you see what
I'm saying? If that's the case, then how could you even have any clear
communication? So if a word like destruction doesn't mean what it is,
we might as well burn all our dictionaries. That's chaos, confusion
and insanity man!
#3
If eternal torment is the punishment for sin and rejecting Jesus,
then Jesus sacrifice for sin on the cross was not good enough because
to equal the punishment for sin, Jesus would still need to be in hell
being tormented forever, as payment for sin. The bible says the wages
of sin is death, so the price of death needs to be paid for sin, but
if you define death to mean eternal life in hell, then Jesus' death
on the cross for payment of sin was never good enough, since eternal
suffering would be the price to pay for sin.... but we know that's
not true. Jesus paid for sin with his death and suffering on the
cross, so there is no need or requirement for eternal torment as
payment for sin.
#4
– The bible says a man shall reap what he has sown. The law of
Moses also states an eye for and eye, tooth for tooth, life for life,
hand for hand but if eternal torment is the punishment of the lost,
then that would be reaping way way more than what is sown.
Gal
6:7 EX 21:24
That
would be like equal to everlasting torture as payment for a tooth,
since everlasting torture, pain and suffering would be far worse than
annihilation in the lake of fire, what the scriptures truly teach.
When we think of the word justice, we think equal payment for the
crime. In other words, if you caused $1000 of damage, you should pay
back $1000 of the damages you caused. But those who teach eternal
torment say you need to pay like, a billion dollars for a $1000 of
damage. So when the bible says life for life, it means just that. For
sin, you have to pay with your life. The wages of sin is death, but
when one relies on Christ as payment for sin, then it is payed, his
life for your life. By this we see, eternal torment is impossible
because God is just, only allowing in judgment, no more or less than
what is reaped from what is sown, or else, according to much of the
church, God is a hypocrite, breaking his own law.
#5
Scripture states that death and hell will be cast into the lake of
fire, so then, why do Christians say death will be no more, but not
hell, since both are cast into the same place to be destroyed? Does
the lake of fire cause death to be no more, but allows hell to
continue on??? That makes no scriptural sense. Both death and hell
are cast into the lake of fire, so it is reasonable to believe that
both death and hell will be annihilated from existence at that time.
Therefore, eternal torment is impossible if hell doesn't even exist,
since it will be cast into the lake of fire with death, to be
destroyed forever (Rev 20:14). So again, why do Christian brethren
say, when cast into the lake of fire, into the same place, that
death will be destroyed, but not hell.
#6
The Apostle Paul writes in I Cor 15:54
When this corruptible shall have
put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have
put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the
saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
Was
the Apostle wrong. How could he write that if we are already
immortal. But clearly and in plain, non metaphorical language, Paul
here says we are mortal, so by this, the eternal life in hell
doctrine is unscriptural. The doctrine of the immortal soul is a lie,
and proven so, by this scripture.
#7
The near death encounters of people who've supposedly visited hell
are nothing more than the demons masquerading hell. The same people
who believe in the doctrine of eternal torment are the same people
who also believe that demons can give false visions and dreams. If
this is so, then why do they not believe that demons can masquerade
hell? They can masquerade visions and dreams, but not hell??? And if
the near death encountered person visited hell, then how can they
presume hell is forever existing from their experience? They were
never told in the near death encounter that hell is forever in their
testimonies, so that is a presumption. In their near death encounter,
maybe they had a momentary vision of wicked souls to be punished in a
temporary state in the future in the lake of fire and not the ongoing
everlasting torture that they interpreted to be seeing.
So
I ask you, do we put people's questionable experiences above the
solidity of non metaphorical, plainly spoken scripture, which teaches
annihilation, or do we put the solidity of non metaphorical, plainly
spoken scripture above questionable interpreations of supernatural
experiences, which can be manipulated by the demons, to make the
gospel appear, unbelievable and illogical?
#8
None of the words translated "hell”, in scripture, means a place
of eternal torment. The original Greek words translated in scripture
as hell comes from one of three Greek words in the new testament.
The
first one being hades, which simply means, the grave. The 2nd
word is Gehenna, it was merely a place outside of Jerusalem where
people burned their trash, a trash dump. Jesus likened lost souls to
Gehenna meaning a place where trash was burnt up and consumed, not an
on going eternal suffering and burning. Hello! The trash is not still
there and was never in a scorching, everlasting burn?
And
the 3rd Greek word, only used once in the new testament
Tartarus, which is a holding place or prison for demons who overstep
their boundaries. So none of the Greek words translated hell in the
new testament means a place of everlasting torture, but translators,
out of the dark ages and modern translators copy catting, have
translated those words as hell, what many presumptuous, low
information Christians refer to as, the place of eternal torment.
#9
The Greek pagan religions of Rome and throughout the Roman Empire
already had a doctrine of hell and the “underworld” that was used
by the authorities of their day to keep people subservient and in
order, through religion. When the falling away from the true faith of
Jesus happened in the 2nd and 3rd century, the Greek & Roman
pagans took over much of the church and they brought with them some
of their doctrines, one of which was the eternal torment doctrine. A
simple google search of “Greek religion underworld”, will open
your eyes to it. More detail on the history of this, will be covered
in part 3 of this video. So this hell doctrine, came from the Greek
pagans who compromised with the empire and took over the church back
in the 4th century.
#10
The doctrine of eternal torment hell goes against every fiber of a
fair, just, gracious and loving God and his character traits. Think!
If you, being not nearly as loving and gracious as our Heavenly
Father, would not even think of creating a place of eternal torture
for the lost, how is it that he would? But at the same time, God is
just and punishment for sin must be met by the law. Thank God for
Jesus, who paid the price for sin, in full and this love, to lay down
his own life for us, is in vast contradiction to the doctrine of
eternal torment.
#11
If the old testament is so silent on such a place of eternal torture
and was written in the time of 2/3s of all of the earth's history,
how is it that we could say God is just, but does not give a fair
warning to those poor ignorant barbarians in the bush, who never had
a chance to hear about avoiding “hell?” Everyone accept
pre-conditioned religious people can see, that is a complete
corruption of sound judgment. True, no one deserves eternal life in
the first place. We
can't
earn it and we can't work for it, but at the same time, no mere
ignorant lost human deserves eternal torture. This is something Satan
would do, not God.
#12
– There are far more scriptures describing annihilation than
metaphorical verses Christians take to mean eternal torment. In fact
there are over 100 scriptures that deal with death and judgment in
annihilation, but there are only 16 verses in the entire bible that
appear to support the eternal torment doctrine and all of those 16
verses are highly metaphorical, meaning, Christian brethren have to
stretch a metaphor or parable and not the plain language scriptures,
to make those verses fit their eternal torment doctrine. That's an
intellectual dishonesty.
Part
2 – The scriptures
We
read in the book of revelation “And the devil who deceived them,
was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the
false prophet are and shall be tormented day and night for ever and
ever (Rev 20:10).
At
first reading, it appears this supports the doctrine of eternal life
in hell, but paying closer attention to detail, this passage of
scripture only applies to the devil, the beast and the false
prophet. It doesn't mention this punishment for the common man,&
to apply it to the common man, is presumptuous...
Here
is one scripture that is very clearly, in plain language support of
annihilation. Jesus said “And do not fear those who kill the body,
but cannot kill the soul, but rather fear him who is able to destroy
both soul and body in hell” (Matthew 10:28).
So
you see, this is the very clear, non metaphorical words of Jesus,
that the soul is not immortal, but can be, in Jesus words, destroyed
in hell.
As
I discussed in part one, Luke chapter 16 is one of the strongest
scriptures used for the eternal torment doctrine, but if you read
that entire chapter, not once does it mention any length of time for
the rich man in hell, so while some people may take this parable as
literal and and not metaphorical, the length of time given for such
a punishment is not even there. This may have just been a total
metaphor, or, he could have been describing the rich man's metered
out, future punishment in the lake of fire, unto annihilation of
existence. By the rich man showing no mercy on the beggar Lazarus,
then he would be shown no mercy. He would be reaping just what he had
sown in a fair and just judgment.
However,
from being born again in 1987 and studying the scriptures on this
subject for more than 2 decades, I can say what the scriptures most
support is that people are dead in the grave, with a few exceptions
such a Moses, Elijah and others (Matt 17) until either the 1st
or 2nd resurrections. If you are raised from the dead in
the 1st resurrection, you are saved, but will also have to
appear before the judgment seat of Christ (romans 14:10 – 2 Cor
5:10) to give an account for how you spent your life.
Those
without Christ will be raised at the 2nd resurrection (Rev
20:5-15) & will be judged according to their works, and then the
wicked at the 2nd resurrection will be cast into the lake
of fire with possibly, a metered out time of suffering in the lake of
fire, for those who are worthy of such a punishment, then, will be
annihilated from existence in the lake of fire once their metered out
time of suffering is complete, which the scripture calls several
times in the book of revelation, the 2nd death.
Now,
if people just die and go strait to an eternal conscious torment
hell, then what's the need for a 2nd resurrection? Why would God
raise people from hell, then judge them and then throw them back into
hell a 2nd time and call it a 2nd death? What's the need for that?
Wouldn't that be a third death? A 1st death out of the
flesh n blood body of this life, a 2nd death of going
strait to hell and then, raised to life at the 2nd resurrection, only
to be thrown into the lake of fire for a “3rd death,”. That makes
no sense whatsoever. What does make sense is what the scriptures
teach on the fate of those without Christ, that people are asleep in
their grave until the 2nd resurrection.
Matthew
25:46 says “And these shall go away into everlasting punishment,
but the righteous to eternal life.”
I
ask you, is the everlasting punishment here death or eternal torment?
If someone gets the death penalty for murder, that's an everlasting
punishment because death lasts forever, so this interpretation aligns
with the rest of the scriptures on this subject, but those who
continue to defend the eternal torture doctrine will continue to read
into this an everlasting unjust punishment of eternal life in hell.
Mark
9:42-48 tells a description of judgment “where the worm dies not
and the fire is not quenched.” It also calls hell “the
unquenchable fire.” This is all metaphorical talk, meaning the
judgement is impossible to escape and is final. When you burn
something in a fire, it is quenched, but the fire itself is not
quenched. Jesus here is using a metaphor to make a point, that the
judgement of death in the lake of fire is certain and final and
forever, so the souls of the wicked, in the lake of fire, will be
consumed totally and completely and not burning forever, like a piece
of paper in a hot burning wood stove, burnt up, in death, but not
continuously burning, in an eternal conscious torment.
The
deeper message Christ is trying to portray here, by using this
metaphorical speech, is that we should fear such a judgment of
annihilation because of the greatness of eternity in Heaven and to miss
that would be the ultimate defeat in life. This is one reason why
Christ got so metaphorically graphic about annihilation. He was
doing it out of love for those who needed to hear it because some
people will not respond to his gentle love, so he then uses stronger
language here, to awaken those who need it.
These
few scriptures the eternal torment supporters use, are all in
metaphorical language and the nature of parables and metaphors are
more open to interpretation than language that is plainly spoken. We
see by the plainly spoken language of scripture, that annihilation is
what the bible teaches and not the doctrine of eternal torment.
Part
3 The History of Hell
The
ancient Greek and roman pagan religions already had a doctrine of
eternal torment by the 3rd century BC. This idea of hell
or the underworld in the after life was used by those empires to keep
people in check, thru fear. In a nut shell, when the corrupt church
state union happened in the 4th century AD, paganism and
the pure faith of Jesus intermingled thru that church state union and
thus, this idea was introduced into their mass media, empire church
formed at that time. It was a huge deception, pulled off by the
empire because the empire foresaw, they could not defeat the pure
faith of Jesus, so they then hatched a plan to merge it with the
empire, in order to re-unite a fragmenting Roman empire.
By
the time of the reign of Constantine, the roman empire had been very
fragmented. The great persecutions against Christians had begun to
change the culture and with that, came much division. While
Constantine was looking for some way to unite his fragmented empire,
the demons were behind the scenes to hatch the plan of uniting the
pagan religions and the pure faith of Jesus, so it would loose its
holy spirit power and purity. Covetous priests and weary saints,
were lined up to accept the compromise, to end the persecutions and
bring in a grand new beginning, where everyone would be united under
the new empire religion, that would be established in the name of
Christ. Since the romans could not defeat the pure faith of Christ,
the compromise was reached and thru the course of the 4th
and 5th centuries, much intermingling of paganism and the
pure faith became the established doctrine of that church of Rome,
and the hand me down theology that is promoted in today's theological
seminaries.
Part
4 - A Challenge to Change.
Now
saint of God, I want to make a really important point here \.... I
want you to grasp this and that is, the demons have done a most
fabulous job at distorting this issue. The demons have used this very
issue to raise up cults who teach the truth of annihilation, but then
take the power of that truth and twist it to serve a perverted
religious control over people and they tell you all those churches
out there who believe in that doctrine of eternal torment, that they
are not of God, but that's not true! God does not save us or work
thru us because our knowledge of him is perfect in every way.
No
one has ever gotten saved because they had all their knowledge of God
correct. Perfect knowledge of God is not a requirement for God to
work thru you. Jesus said to whom much is given, much is required,
but since the pure church was lost from the dark ages, it is not
required of us to have the perfect knowledge of God at this time.
Now
here's my main point. I've seen God work miracles in religious groups
who do,.... and don't, believe in the doctrine of eternal torment,
but lets get one thing strait, just because, and here's my main
point, just because God works thru you who do believe in the doctrine
of eternal torment, don't let that puff you up to think you got all
your religious knowledge of him correct..... and that is the demonic
trap many Christian leaders fall into and so, they become hard
hearted about their false doctrine of eternal torment because they
see God working thru their ministry and by this, think God has
approval on every piece of doctrine they're teaching on and that is
not true. Perfect knowledge of scripture is not a requirement for God
to work thru you.
And
on the other side, those who see this truth and are preaching the law
and sabbath keeping or other strange doctrine and they've allowed the
truth of this issue to also harden them as well, to blind them into
relying on the law and works for salvation. On both sides of the
isle, they are turning many people away from the faith.
The
only true religious knowledge you need, so that God can work thru
you, is to know Jesus Christ is the Lord and to repent from sin.
Faith and repentance and that opens the door for God to work thru
you, whether you believe or don't believe in the doctrine of eternal
torment, but if you openly preach that doctrine of eternal torment,
you will grieve the Holy Spirit and you will be misrepresenting the
Lord Jesus.
I
challenge the church to answer the sound demands of this video and
don't use diversion tactics by quoting metaphorical scriptures. Be
honest, come clean and answer direct to the specific points I've made
in this video. Don't try to cover up the conscience of what I proved
to you by scripture. Remember, God is not going to break his own law
by allowing someone to be tormented forever, when the law says eye
for eye, tooth for tooth, life for life...... don't try to redefine
the words death and perish to mean eternal life in hell.
These
challenges to your conscience and to scripture are solid and if
you're going to defend the lie of eternal torment, then you are
agreeing to God breaking his own law. And your testimony of eternal
torment would make God a hypocrite by breaking his own law and that
is a terrible witness for Jesus and for the human conscience to even,
have faith. You therefore, made the gospel illogical and
unbelievable. You've hindered people from believing in Christ.
If
someone is defending the eternal torment doctrine, its because they
have a vested interest in a cover up of this, so they can keep their
church job, or status with their church or ministry, but some people
are so thoroughly, cult like brainwashed, that they will need to get
a heart wrenching rebuke before the throne of Christ, for
misrepresenting him here on earth.
This
truth, that there is no eternal torment hell, is a great relief and
great joy, because people can now all the more believe on the Lord
Jesus for eternal life and not be hindered in their conscience by the
unbelieveableness of doctrine of eternal torment. They now can know
that God is just, merciful and wanting to save them from their sin,
thru the atoning death and resurrection of our king Jesus Christ.
And
for all you atheists and agnostics out there that have been hindered
by this doctrine, I hope you will take a look into your past and see
the crossroad , that time you decided not to believe in Jesus because
you were hindered from believing because of this false teaching of
the majority of the churches. I hope you will re-evaluate the true
Christian faith, before all that demonic church state BS of the roman
empire came into play and distorted everything that was pure and
simple, in the true, original, Christian faith.
Weather's other Sites